X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.2 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,HTML_10_20, 	HTML_MESSAGE,UNPARSEABLE_RELAY autolearn=no version=3.1.0
Sender: -1.2 (spamval) -- NONE
Return-Path: <improvetheworld-errors &AElig umich.edu>
Received: from newman.eecs.umich.edu (newman.eecs.umich.edu [141.213.4.11]) 	by boston.eecs.umich.edu (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id jA6N48S8024317 	(version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL) 	for <dreeves &AElig boston.eecs.umich.edu>; Sun, 6 Nov 2005 18:04:08 -0500
Received: from galaxyquest.mr.itd.umich.edu (galaxyquest.mr.itd.umich.edu [141.211.93.145]) 	by newman.eecs.umich.edu (8.13.2/8.13.0) with ESMTP id jA6N47CL017598; 	Sun, 6 Nov 2005 18:04:07 -0500
Received: FROM wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.203]) 	BY galaxyquest.mr.itd.umich.edu ID 436E8BC7.4D9FF.19250 ;  	 6 Nov 2005 18:03:35 -0500
Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 67so575538wri         for <improvetheworld &AElig umich.edu>; Sun, 06 Nov 2005 15:03:35 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws;         s=beta; d=gmail.com;         h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references;         b=cXWWNOSa8GvDjtyDfSk+jUzZN+ku44fPN9bUP9QcHqIxL76s6ci12RCkt+zXCSmNO8778FxJo977hpgLGszQmazsHHdMGioKkHzp+ZUuQzejRmSayLabUO7ujCqLmv9hBKrGjGa0aqEBkyVfBmD+ZdJgWBANuSixaIwERTDFdEE=
Received: by 10.65.110.10 with SMTP id n10mr4645068qbm;         Sun, 06 Nov 2005 15:03:35 -0800 (PST)
Received: by 10.65.243.11 with HTTP; Sun, 6 Nov 2005 15:03:34 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID: <8d3580670511061503u69a167d9ib2695c5a18be7cc5 &AElig mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.63.0511061654510.14216 &AElig arkanoid.gpcc.itd.umich.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;  	boundary="----=_Part_33986_11307490.1131318214993"
References: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0511040308500.13491 &AElig boston.eecs.umich.edu> 	 <20051105235102.ju1h68g8gowo88sw &AElig web.mail.umich.edu> 	 <Pine.LNX.4.63.0511061654510.14216 &AElig arkanoid.gpcc.itd.umich.edu>
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.0 (2005-09-13) on  	newman.eecs.umich.edu
X-Virus-Scan: : UVSCAN at UoM/EECS
Date: Sun, 6 Nov 2005 18:03:34 -0500
To: Yevgeniy Vorobeychik <yvorobey &AElig umich.edu>
Cc: Michelle Sternthal <mjste &AElig umich.edu>, Daniel Reeves <dreeves &AElig umich.edu>,         improvetheworld &AElig umich.edu
From: Lisa Hsu <lisashoe &AElig gmail.com>
Subject: Re: are you a feminist?
Status: RO
X-Status: 
X-Keywords:                 
X-UID: 282

------=_Part_33986_11307490.1131318214993
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Disposition: inline

> 3. (This is in response to Lisa's comment). I really don't see why it has
> to be black and white: either you are a feminist or you are a misogynist.
> It is not objective reality that women are oppressed, even if there is
> compelling evidence to that effect. Furthermore, we may well disagree on
> the means, and feminism, among other things, is a political movement. Thi=
s
> is why my choice was "depends". I rarely make black and white
> distinctions. They just don't make sense to me...



i suppose this is a disagreement on level of abstraction. i don't think of
feminism as a political movement. i mean, there are elements of
politicalness to it, but at heart, i just think a feminist is just someone
who is essentially a humanist. someone who thinks all people are people
first, and equal under the eyes of god, if you believe in god. there are
other kinds of feminists i suppose, who battle specifically in the war
between men and women, but i'm more of the "by feminism, i mean a feminist
thinks a woman is as much a person as a man. by corollary, all races are as
much people as any other race, and any distinctions you might make between
people does not ever make them any less human."

which is why, painted in this light, i believe you can either be a feminist
or a misogynist. it has nothing to do with methods or means in my mind, it'=
s
just a basic belief system.

lisa

------=_Part_33986_11307490.1131318214993
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Disposition: inline

<br>
<div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"border-left: 1px solid rgb(=
204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">3. (This is =
in response to Lisa's comment). I really don't see why it has<br>to be blac=
k and white: either you are a feminist or you are a misogynist.
<br>It is not objective reality that women are oppressed, even if there is<=
br>compelling evidence to that effect. Furthermore, we may well disagree on=
<br>the means, and feminism, among other things, is a political movement. T=
his
<br>is why my choice was &quot;depends&quot;. I rarely make black and white=
<br>distinctions. They just don't make sense to me...</blockquote><div><br>
<br>
i suppose this is a disagreement on level of abstraction.&nbsp; i don't
think of feminism as a political movement.&nbsp; i mean, there are
elements of politicalness to it, but at heart, i just think a feminist
is just someone who is essentially a humanist.&nbsp; someone who thinks
all people are people first, and equal under the eyes of god, if you
believe in god.&nbsp; there are other kinds of feminists i suppose, who
battle specifically in the war between men and women, but i'm more of
the &quot;by feminism, i mean a feminist thinks a woman is as much a person
as a man.&nbsp; by corollary, all races are as much people as any other
race, and any distinctions you might make between people does not ever
make them any less human.&quot;&nbsp; <br>
<br>
which is why, painted in this light, i believe you can either be a
feminist or a misogynist.&nbsp; it has nothing to do with methods or
means in my mind, it's just a basic belief system.<br>
<br>
lisa<br>
</div><br></div><br>

------=_Part_33986_11307490.1131318214993--