X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,UNPARSEABLE_RELAY autolearn=unavailable version=3.1.0 Sender: -2.6 (spamval) -- NONE Return-Path: Received: from newman.eecs.umich.edu (newman.eecs.umich.edu [141.213.4.11]) by boston.eecs.umich.edu (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j9RKfp7E017986 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL) for ; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 16:41:52 -0400 Received: from ghostbusters.mr.itd.umich.edu (ghostbusters.mr.itd.umich.edu [141.211.93.144]) by newman.eecs.umich.edu (8.13.2/8.13.0) with ESMTP id j9RKfoNA005140 for ; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 16:41:51 -0400 Received: FROM beyondborders.mr.itd.umich.edu (beyondborders.mr.itd.umich.edu [141.211.93.146]) BY ghostbusters.mr.itd.umich.edu ID 43613B8B.FC98.25767 ; 27 Oct 2005 16:41:47 -0400 Received: from [141.211.132.124] ([141.211.132.124]) by beyondborders.mr.itd.umich.edu (smtp) with ESMTP id j9RKfkNp025357; Thu, 27 Oct 2005 16:41:46 -0400 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v623) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.623) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.0 (2005-09-13) on newman.eecs.umich.edu X-Virus-Scan: : UVSCAN at UoM/EECS Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 16:41:41 -0400 To: Daniel Reeves Cc: improvetheworld Æ umich.edu From: robfelty Subject: Re: Work/Life Panel Discussion (fwd) Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 242 Very good point about woman as an adjective Danny. To draw from Seinfeld, there is an episode where Jerry dates a beautiful woman who has only one flaw - "man hands" (not male hands). I think using male or female as an adjective is generally quite neutral. It merely refers to the biological makeup of a person. But referring to someone as a man or woman says something about their personality and many other traits. I know this to be the case in sociolinguistics. Male or female refers to sex. Woman or man refers to gender, which is much more complicated than sex. In the Seinfeld example, "man hands" is clearly derogatory, and "woman governor" is also saying much more than the fact that that the governor is female. It may be pointing out the fact that having a female governor is rare, or perhaps even drawing into questions whether a female governor can be as good as a male. In summary, I agree Danny. This is not a good phrase, and it should be avoided. Rob On Oct 27, 2005, at 4:18 PM, Daniel Reeves wrote: > Looks like our lively debate about feminism was not the only thing set > off by that New York Times article... > > Btw, am I the only to whom "woman" or "women" used as an adjective is > like fingernails on a blackboard? Like "woman governor"? Could our > resident linguist comment on this? Is it new? It sounds utterly > wrong to my ear. But I suppose what really bothers me about it is that > it's not symmetric. You can't say "man governor". (Or even "man > nurse".) > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2005 15:28:41 -0400 > To: Lyris Announcement List > From: blaack Æ umich.edu > Subject: [awis-um] Fwd: Work/Life Panel Discussion > > In response to the NYTimes article attached -- indicating that college > women are increasingly skeptical about their ability or desire to > combine work lives with family lives--Women's Studies, IRWG, WISE and > ADVANCE have collaborated to put together a panel of women speakers > who have a range of personal and work lives. Our hope is to highlight > the many different ways that contemporary women can and do in fact > combine work and personal life successfully. The panel is aimed at > undergraduate students, so I'm hoping you'll bring it to your > students' attention. The flyer is attached, as are brief bios about > the panelists and our special guest moderator. > > --Abby Stewart > > > ----- End forwarded message ----- article.doc>